DeepSummary
The podcast episode discusses the growing use of AI and surveillance technologies by governments to monitor and control the movement of refugees and migrants at national borders. Immigration lawyer Petra Molnar explains how borders have become testing grounds for experimental technologies like robotic dogs, drones, biometrics, and DNA collection that infringe on human rights and often lead to loss of life.
Molnar highlights economic incentives driving the "border industrial complex" where private companies profit from selling increasingly intrusive technologies marketed as solutions to the "threat" of migration. However, she argues that deterrence doesn't work as people will risk everything to escape desperate situations, so resources should focus on addressing root causes rather than militarizing borders.
The episode explores how technologies pioneered at borders can then diffuse into cities for broader public surveillance and control. Molnar cautions this normalization of invasive tech sets a dangerous precedent as the world faces a potential future with over a billion climate refugees by 2050, requiring more ethical, humane solutions that uphold human dignity.
Key Episodes Takeaways
- Governments are increasingly deploying unproven and unethical AI surveillance technologies like robotic dogs, drones, and biometrics at national borders to monitor and deter migration.
- This militarization of borders is driven by private companies profiting from a growing "border industrial complex" that markets intrusive tech as solutions to the "threat" of migration.
- However, such deterrence methods are ineffective as people will risk anything to escape desperate situations, so resources should focus on addressing root causes of migration.
- There are serious human rights concerns that these technologies infringe on dignity, lead to loss of life, and set a dangerous precedent for broader public surveillance as climate change drives more migration.
- While some countries see economic incentives to be border enforcers now, there needs to be regulation and ethical red lines to prevent a race to the bottom before seamless diffusion of invasive technologies enables further social control.
- The mass data collection underpinning AI border systems is a profit motive and source of power, but also makes already vulnerable populations more exploitable.
- There is a crucial window now for public pressure and activism to prevent further normalization of unethical border technologies before the technologies become ubiquitous and even harder to dislodge.
- Long-term, more ethical and humane approaches are needed that focus on integrating migrants and upholding human rights rather than militarizing borders against a reality the world cannot wish away.
Top Episodes Quotes
- “Again, the border tech stuff doesnt just stay at the border, but it then starts proliferating into other spaces of public life. And, you know, weve seen similar technology like drones and different types of cell phone tracking be deployed against protesters and even things like sports stadium surveillance.“ by Petra Molnar
- “I think my silence is indicating that it's hard to think of a positive like that. But I will say we are catching this at a really crucial moment, because there are conversations about well, how do we regulate some of this? Do we put some red lines under some of this technology?“ by Petra Molnar
- “So if we know all of that and then we also see this kind of race to the bottom that states are engaged in, I think that's absolutely right, of beefing up their borders, like really strengthening border security and not wanting to be the country that says, oh, well, okay, my doors are open. What are the incentives there?“ by Petra Molnar
- “And I don't mean to just fear monger or kind of future predict or anything. This is based on years of work across different borders and seeing the appetite for a level of technological incursion that I don't think is going to stop anytime soon.“ by Petra Molnar
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Episode Information
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Tristan Harris and Aza Raskin, The Center for Humane Technology
6/20/24