DeepSummary
Matthew Sitman and Sam Adler-Bell discuss the long-standing debate over whether Donald Trump and his presidency can be considered fascist. They examine three different approaches to analyzing if Trumpism constitutes fascism: comparing it to a checklist of fascist characteristics, looking at whether the historical conditions that gave rise to fascism are present, and evaluating Trump's ability to achieve authoritarian goals.
They delve into the role of white supremacy in the American context, drawing parallels between Trump's politics and past racial oppression. The events of January 6th are analyzed, with some seeing it as pushing Trump into the fascist category while others view it as an ultimately failed attempt lacking the organization for a genuine coup.
The co-hosts also explore the political implications of labeling Trump a fascist, as some on the left warn it could be used to demand uncritical support for liberal anti-Trump efforts. Ultimately, they conclude the fascism debate is valuable for clarifying the forces at play, even if definitive answers remain elusive.
Key Episodes Takeaways
- The debate over whether Donald Trump and Trumpism constitute fascism is complex, with multiple analytical approaches examining characteristics, historical conditions, and ability to achieve authoritarian goals.
- America's legacy of racial oppression provides an important lens for understanding any fascistic tendencies of Trumpism within the U.S. context.
- The events of January 6th provoked divergent views, with some seeing it as confirmation of fascist leanings and others as an unorganized failure.
- Applying the 'fascist' label holds strategic political implications, potentially being used to demand uncritical anti-Trump unity or provide justification for left populism.
- While the hosts don't reach a definitive conclusion, they see value in the fascism debate for clarifying the forces and ideologies at play.
- Psychological dimensions like narcissism and ability to channel mass angst allow figures like Trump to forge unlikely connections with supporters.
- Examining parallels between Trump and histories of racial oppression in America yields different insights than comparing to European fascist movements.
- The role of robust civic institutions and associational life is seen as key to the rise of fascism in some analyses, with debate over whether modern conditions mirror those precedents.
Top Episodes Quotes
- “And so I think with fascist leaders, and certainly in the case of Hitler and Trump in this instance, you have this thing where their personal psychology mimics some kind of psychic harm that is experienced by the masses, and therefore they can communicate. They can have this connection that doesn't really make sense. They might not come from the same strata, but they can have this psychic affective connection that works because their individual personal narcissism can be manifested.“ by Sam Edler Bell
- “And this is precisely why on a much earlier episode, our alarm bells went off when Josh Hawley started talking about this cosmopolitan elite that was undermining american values and faith in the american project. You know, he used the term cosmopolitan elite, and some people started saying, oh, well, that's anti semitic.“ by Sam Edler Bell
- “I think the thing, I already gestured to this, but I think the reason that this particular gloss on the fascism question with regard to Trump, meaning the way in which he can be a fascist and be fascism, is not necessarily an import of the old world, that it can have its own american genealogy and that he can be an expression of that. The reason that that hasn't sort of taken purchase exactly in the debates that continue to roil on Twitter and annoy us is that acknowledging that is sort of just an indictment of the white, conservative, anti democratic racist project, broadly speaking.“ by Sam Edler Bell
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Episode Information
Know Your Enemy
Matthew Sitman
1/17/21