DeepSummary
This episode features an interview with author Nathan Thrall about his book 'A Day in the Life of Abed Salama: Anatomy of a Jerusalem Tragedy'. Thrall discusses the 'system of domination' implemented by Israel to control and constrict the lives of Palestinians living in the occupied West Bank. He explains how this system involves permit restrictions, movement limitations, segregated infrastructure, and punitive measures like arrests and detentions.
Thrall argues that the continued Israeli occupation and expansion of settlements in the West Bank, despite the stated goal of a two-state solution, has made that solution increasingly unrealistic. He believes Israel has little incentive to withdraw from the occupied territories due to a lack of significant pressure. Thrall sees the likely outcomes as either continued apartheid-like conditions or potential mass expulsion of Palestinians.
The conversation also touches on the regional context, including the possibility of war with Lebanon's Hezbollah and escalating tensions with Iran. Thrall expresses concern over the hardening of Israeli public opinion against making concessions to the Palestinians following the recent violence in Gaza.
Key Episodes Takeaways
- Israel has implemented a comprehensive 'system of domination' to control and constrain Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, including permits, movement restrictions, segregated infrastructure, arrests and detentions.
- The continued expansion of Israeli settlements in the West Bank has made a negotiated two-state solution based on the 1967 borders increasingly unrealistic and unlikely.
- Recent violence in Gaza and hardening Israeli public opinion has pushed more Israelis to accept the right-wing view that the conflict is existential rather than just about occupied lands.
- Despite the Gaza conflict, Israel's normalization process with Arab states like the UAE does not appear to have been halted or significantly derailed.
- The author sees the primary outcomes being either continued apartheid-like conditions for Palestinians or potential mass expulsion, given Israel's lack of incentive to withdraw from the occupied territories.
- The regional context, including threats of war with Hezbollah and tensions with Iran, is also a factor shaping Israel's calculations regarding the occupied territories.
- The author argues Israel is unlikely to grant Palestinians either full citizenship and equality or genuine sovereignty over 22% of the land unless faced with significant pressure or credible threats.
- The book aims to provide a 'visceral' understanding of Palestinian life under occupation through first-person narratives.
Top Episodes Quotes
- “The basic element is that you have a process of jewish expansion, taking over palestinian territory and constricting Palestinians into tighter and tighter space.“ by Nathan Thrall
- “What I wanted to do was rather than just describe that, as I'm doing now, in a general way to give very specific stories so that people understood what it really meant for a human being to live through that.“ by Nathan Thrall
- “My view is that the israeli right was much closer to actually an accurate analysis of what this conflict is really about. And I think that October 7 was a rude awakening for many, many Israelis on the center and the left, in the sense of realizing that maybe the right was right.“ by Nathan Thrall
- “I don't believe that the process of integration, as you put it, has come to a halt, actually. I mean, the fact that we are nearly nine months into this mass slaughter in Gaza and the UAE and the other states that normalized with Israel over the past several years have not even hinted that that normalization, that their relations with Israel will be called into question or downgraded.“ by Nathan Thrall
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Episode Information
Intercepted
The Intercept
7/3/24
The process of Jewish expansion over Palestinian land has involved maintaining a "system of domination," says author Nathan Thrall on this week's Intercepted. In order to constrict "Palestinians into tighter and tighter space" over the decades, Israel has deployed a strict permit system, movement restrictions, walls, fences, segregated roads, and punitive actions such as arrests and detentions, even of children.
In “A Day in the Life of Abed Salama: Anatomy of a Jerusalem Tragedy," Thrall’s book, published just before the start of the current war, tells the story of one Palestinian man’s struggle to navigate Israel’s painful system of legal and security controls after his son’s school bus is involved in a fatal accident. Thrall joins host Murtaza Hussain in a discussion about the system of control that Israel maintains over Palestinians, violence in the West Bank, the future outlook for a negotiated solution to the conflict in Gaza, and possible escalation amid fighting at Israel’s northern border.
"A Day in the Life of Abed Salama" is a 2024 nonfiction Pulitzer Prize winner. Thrall is also the author of "The Only Language They Understand: Forcing Compromise in Israel and Palestine."
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